Philosophical Questions: Improvement

[ysabetwordsmith]

People have expressed interest in deep topics, so this list focuses on philosophical questions.

Are people ethically obligated to improve themselves?


No. What you do with your own life, learning, body, etc. is your free choice. It is both ethical and advisable to improve yourself, but you don't have to. Maybe you're happy the way you are, maybe you don't have the resources for self-improvement, whatever. Don't should on yourself.

Note that this is a general parameter. Some ethical systems may place additional requirements on people who choose to follow them -- in which case, this comes under "choosing to improve yourself."

Comments

Re: Well ...

[ysabetwordsmith]

>> Still, I don't think it is bad for people to expect parents/alloparents to try and teach their kids stuff like "Don't throw rocks at people," <<

I think it's good to try. I don't think it's good to demand that people meet social expectations in order to be allowed into society and treated like human beings, and that is what usually happens. You have to be able to speak. You have to be either normal, or able to fake normal. Or people feel free to abuse you.

>> (& I /do/ think it is bad idea to force kids to make eye contact, spend time with people they are uncomfortable with, etc.) <<

Agreed. Because it teaches them that other people are vicious predators, and who wants to be around assholes?

>> Socially, it's a bit of a back-and-forth: what am I okay with, what are you okay with, what does-or-will work for both of us? <<

That is much more sensible.

Re: Well ...

[see_also_friend]

>>I think it's good to try. I don't think it's good to demand that people meet social expectations...<<

In my experience you usually encourage toddlers (and folk in similar developmental phases) barring safety rules (which should be explained if time and communication issues allow).

>>...in order to be allowed into society and treated like human beings,...<<

You are still a person, regardless of behavior.

Hence my "I'll do what I can, you do what you can, let's see what we can figure out," attitude.

Re: Well ...

[ysabetwordsmith]

>> In my experience you usually encourage toddlers (and folk in similar developmental phases) barring safety rules (which should be explained if time and communication issues allow).<<

That's a good approach.

One thing I like about Terramagne is that they acknowledge not everyone can do everything. After you've made a reasonable attempt and haven't learned to do a thing -- or learned a specific reason why you can't do it, like how severe dyslexia can preclude reading -- then you're entitled to switch to something else. So for instance, around high school or college level, "Math Alternatives" appears so you can learn some simplified workarounds, how to hire a bookkeeper, etc.

>>You are still a person, regardless of behavior.

Hence my "I'll do what I can, you do what you can, let's see what we can figure out," attitude.<<

The world needs more people like you.

Re: Well ...

[see_also_friend]

>>That's a good approach.<<

Thanks!

Most verbal kids that I know can reasonably understand things like "Pick up your toys so no-one steps on them," and "We don't eat on the floor because it makes a mess."

Preverbal or nonverbal... depends on what else is going on in there. Maybe there's alternate communication that works, maybe you have to communicate abstractly or model behavior, maybe you have to change the options or environment.

Adults usually respond to calm and appropriately-simpilified-to-current-state explanations, too. The only real differences are that a) the adult is more likely to have preexisting relevant experience to draw on, and b) adults will usually react badly to any sort of babytalk.

>>The world needs more people like you.<<

Thanks.

It's good to hear that.

It's kind of weird to me that most people /don't/ think this way.

Re: Well ...

[ysabetwordsmith]

>> Most verbal kids that I know can reasonably understand things like "Pick up your toys so no-one steps on them," and "We don't eat on the floor because it makes a mess." <<

Logic is a good parenting technique.

>> Preverbal or nonverbal... depends on what else is going on in there. Maybe there's alternate communication that works, maybe you have to communicate abstractly or model behavior, maybe you have to change the options or environment.<<

This world needs a lot more "change the environment, not the person." Just think how much better we'd do by using Montessori methods to address disability. A child can't lift a heavy pitcher? Don't pour for them, provide a smaller pitcher and/or lighter material so they can handle it. They can't reach things? Move the things lower and/or provide a stepstool. The prepared environment enables maximum learning and independence.

I have a couple of favorite principles:

"Find a way to make it do what you want it to do while letting it do what it wants to do." (engineering)

"Make it easy to do the right thing and hard to do the wrong thing." (animal training)

>>It's kind of weird to me that most people /don't/ think this way.<<

It's weird to me too. This society was never a good fit for me and is getting rapidly worse. I wind up relying on my alien cultures training a lot. But I'm just tired of dealing with this shit. I'd rather stay home where, if I tell the birds to calm down and wait for me to finish filling the feeder, most of them understand me.

Re: Well ...

[see_also_friend]

>>Logic is a good parenting technique.<<

Alloparenting on my case but yeah. (Only works well if the communication abilities are high enough though.)

>>"Make it easy to do the right thing and hard to do the wrong thing." (animal training)<<

I did a winnowed-down choices thing just last week, but since the kids were big enough, I explained why the selection needed limiting, and why the things I'd removed weren't options.

>>It's weird to me too. This society was never a good fit for me and is getting rapidly worse.<<

Not sure how much is innate, acquired or actually taught, but even as a kid I was often very concerned about other people.

While I was mostly a good fit, I was introverted [or maybe shy?] and asynchronous enough that people didn't always know what to do with me.

At least there's more info on introvert socialization now that my niblings are sometimes displaying similar traits?