>> Yeah. People just don't wind up in his kind of shape without reason, and most of those reasons are ugly. <<
Agreed, but seeing his kid-like aspects does activate some sympathy that wouldn’t otherwise be present. Calliope has hers, too, but - oh so that’s what it is - she feels to me like the exasperated female older teen stuck with a barely-adolescent brother who just. won’t. stop. grabbing. her. stuff. Their mature adult (such as they are) and superhero aspects are glued on a bit badly, sometimes.
>> it left him with a deep craving for connection that he has attempted to meet in not-that-great ways. <<
Noted.
>> I suspect we've only seen the tip of the iceberg when it comes to Vagary's damage. <<
Probably. At the same time, I think that it’s not entirely necessary to the series at this point , any more than Calliope being more messed up about her gender would be helpful. It will come up, sure but deeply delving into it feel like it would take away from the more interesting dynamic of the characters in their present.
>> Either of them talking to someone who had to deal with an unplanned pregnancy could get a real "Aha!" insight into the other's perspective. <<
Maybe so. Though it might also feel a bit on the nose, depending on whether they got a mismatch in terms of talking to the person who is just deeeelighted or the one who is *so done*.
***
>> In some ways the bond is like a dog that jumps on people, demands attention, winds the leash around them, and knocks over the picnic table. This situation is not helped by Vagary letting it eat off the table and Calliope trying to kick it every time it comes near. <<
I LOVE that metaphor for the whole situation, and am now wondering what they could get out of working with some people who work with animals! Could going to a dog park be one of their outings, perhaps? Lots of opportunity for lively instructive examples. And some safe touch for Vagary that doesn’t come from Calliope! And a chance for Calliope to see physical boundaries set *without* aggression.
>> Ah! I think you've just pinpointed one of the things that Vagary needs. He wants someone to set boundaries for him, because it's so hard for him to find his own. Vagary pushes, not just because he craves closeness (which he does) but because he needs Calliope to draw lines (which she does). If he could be more clear about this, and she could be a little less rough, that would help a lot. <<
That rings true. And that dynamic can play out in a *lot* of different ways in the same relationship, from doing it well or badly in the moment, to pre-planning, to post-event analysis, to deliberate role swapping, to throwing up one’s hands and saying ‘this time you’ve got to figure it out for yourself, too much work already’.
>> Part of that is how subsequent prompts interact with the earliest ones. Some readers have different ideas how the relationship should go, which I think adds verisimilitude to a situation where two complicated people are tripping all over each other. <<
I’m excited about that part, honestly.
>> By all means, prompt for what you want to see. Let me know if you'd like to hear the spoilers for future ideas I have. There's a fair bit that has been set up by previous stuff, not all played out yet. <<
Hmmm…tempting, tempting. I think my best judgment is to wait until it becomes relevant, but I’ll still enjoy reading the eventual posted poems just as much if I do have advance information, so if it IS relevant, you can certainly tell me.
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dancing_serpent
Re: Yay!
Date: 2017-03-28 06:13 pm (UTC)Agreed, but seeing his kid-like aspects does activate some sympathy that wouldn’t otherwise be present. Calliope has hers, too, but - oh so that’s what it is - she feels to me like the exasperated female older teen stuck with a barely-adolescent brother who just. won’t. stop. grabbing. her. stuff. Their mature adult (such as they are) and superhero aspects are glued on a bit badly, sometimes.
>> it left him with a deep craving for connection that he has attempted to meet in not-that-great ways. <<
Noted.
>> I suspect we've only seen the tip of the iceberg when it comes to Vagary's damage. <<
Probably. At the same time, I think that it’s not entirely necessary to the series at this point , any more than Calliope being more messed up about her gender would be helpful. It will come up, sure but deeply delving into it feel like it would take away from the more interesting dynamic of the characters in their present.
>> Either of them talking to someone who had to deal with an unplanned pregnancy could get a real "Aha!" insight into the other's perspective. <<
Maybe so. Though it might also feel a bit on the nose, depending on whether they got a mismatch in terms of talking to the person who is just deeeelighted or the one who is *so done*.
***
>> In some ways the bond is like a dog that jumps on people, demands attention, winds the leash around them, and knocks over the picnic table. This situation is not helped by Vagary letting it eat off the table and Calliope trying to kick it every time it comes near. <<
I LOVE that metaphor for the whole situation, and am now wondering what they could get out of working with some people who work with animals! Could going to a dog park be one of their outings, perhaps? Lots of opportunity for lively instructive examples. And some safe touch for Vagary that doesn’t come from Calliope! And a chance for Calliope to see physical boundaries set *without* aggression.
>> Ah! I think you've just pinpointed one of the things that Vagary needs. He wants someone to set boundaries for him, because it's so hard for him to find his own. Vagary pushes, not just because he craves closeness (which he does) but because he needs Calliope to draw lines (which she does). If he could be more clear about this, and she could be a little less rough, that would help a lot. <<
That rings true. And that dynamic can play out in a *lot* of different ways in the same relationship, from doing it well or badly in the moment, to pre-planning, to post-event analysis, to deliberate role swapping, to throwing up one’s hands and saying ‘this time you’ve got to figure it out for yourself, too much work already’.
>> Part of that is how subsequent prompts interact with the earliest ones. Some readers have different ideas how the relationship should go, which I think adds verisimilitude to a situation where two complicated people are tripping all over each other. <<
I’m excited about that part, honestly.
>> By all means, prompt for what you want to see. Let me know if you'd like to hear the spoilers for future ideas I have. There's a fair bit that has been set up by previous stuff, not all played out yet. <<
Hmmm…tempting, tempting. I think my best judgment is to wait until it becomes relevant, but I’ll still enjoy reading the eventual posted poems just as much if I do have advance information, so if it IS relevant, you can certainly tell me.
I WILL be prompting! :D