The End of the Checkout

[ysabetwordsmith]

This article talks about the end of checkout lanes.  It mostly talks about the bad impact on workers.

Now consider the bad impact on shoppers, which is to say, everyone who is not fluent enough with computers to use self-checkout, everyone who doesn't have a smartphone, and people who just don't want to.  Add in the very negative impact of further reducing human interaction in a country that already has a raging epidemic of loneliness.

Happily, I don't have to worry too much about this.  I live within reach of Amish people who will gladly take my money and bag my groceries.  It would be less convenient to do all shopping there, but more convenient than using only cashierless stores.

Don't like the idea of cashierless stores?  Boycott the cashierless lanes that are showing up now.  There is still time to stop this shit.  Stores can't sell if customers refuse to buy.  You have the power, if you choose to use it -- if enough people choose.  So use your folding vote.  BOTHER them.  Make them drag someone out to the floor to check you out if they've closed all the cashier lanes at night.  They'll quit doing it if you make it a pain in their ass.

Comments

[cmcmck]

Some supermarkets here have them, but the overwhelming majority refuse to use them, self included.

You want me to do a job for you? Pay me the going rate please!

[siliconshaman]

I dunno... that would be boon for people like me who don't necessarily want to be forced to interact with people. One of the local big-box super-markets has a self-scan chip&pin tills so you can pay for your shopping without interacting.

Took me a minute or two to figure it out, the design of the U.I was sub-optimal, but I kind of liked having the choice.

I doubt it will go all one way or another, you'll have a mix of different methods, probably even within one store. Which is great, because then you'll have extrovert and introvert friendly shopping.

[dewline]

That may also be a desirable outcome, and we need to have that discussion too, right?

[siliconshaman]

Yup! 'Monoculture' design inevitably leaves someone out.

Well ...

[ysabetwordsmith]

I'm all for discussing things.

The problem is, the people discussing things are not the people deciding things. We don't get to decide what's in the stores, only what we use once it's there. Unless you own a store, you're at the mercy of people who do; you can't just say, "It would be more accessible to offer 5-10% self-checkout lanes and the rest cashier lanes" or "Spying on people at self-checkout lanes and rifling through everyone's purchases violates civil rights, so don't do that" and make it so.

Well ...

[ysabetwordsmith]

In theory, I would love to have the option of both so more people can shop as they prefer.

In practice, that is not how it's being used, and the trend is clearly to force unwilling customers into working for free by withdrawing the cashier option. Self-checkout saves the company the expense and bother of cashiers. Do you think they're going keep paying cashiers out of the goodness of their hearts? I don't. They don't care how many people they hurt; they only care about themselves.

That means the most effective way to stop stores from making all lanes self-checkout is to boycott the things vigorously.

I wish we could have nice things, but with assholes in charge, that's rarely feasible.

Re: Well ...

[siliconshaman]

Sainsbury's tried that a few years back... they tried to go all self-checkout in a large number of stores, mostly the smaller ones.

Yeah, that did not go well, they saw a >75% drop in business at those locations as people went elsewhere.

People like ordinary tills and cashiers. Especially their core demographic, the over 50's.

Re: Well ...

[cmcmck]

And you get a better class of conversation with a till operator you happen to know which in our local Aldi is all of 'em! :o)

Re: Well ...

[siliconshaman]

My Beloved, who does the Saturday shop, has had shop workers greet her by name and tell her they've just got some stuff in that isn't out yet... and they've gone to get it for her because they know she regularly buys it.

You would not get that with an automated system.

Re: Well ...

[ysabetwordsmith]

>>My Beloved, who does the Saturday shop, has had shop workers greet her by name and tell her they've just got some stuff in that isn't out yet... and they've gone to get it for her because they know she regularly buys it.<<

Yay!

>>You would not get that with an automated system.<<

Automated systems actively stalk you, trying to manipulate you into buying things. Look at how Google stalks people to serve ads. I don't find it appealing, I find it CREEPY. It makes me want to not buy things.

Re: Well ...

[ysabetwordsmith]

I am so happy to hear that!

[ravan]

Introvert friendliness is why I wouldn't eliminate them, but don't make them all robots.

The early machines were downright offensive: patronising, bossy, pushy, constantly telling you what to do like they were your very, VERY, loud mother who was irritated at a slow, dimwitted and recalcitrant child. I work with computers - no goddamn machine has the right to talk to me like that.

[thewayne]

We have three grocery stores here, technically four but one doesn't count as it's a Walmart Neighborhood store and that makes two Walmarts. Aside from Walmart, the other two stores do not have self-checkout. And they keep their fast checkout lanes staffed through all their open hours.

Self-checkout is another way to eliminate jobs and increase profits for the company. My inclination would be to never shop in a store that had only fully-automated checkout, but there may come a time when we have no choice. I hope to live in a country with strong enough labor laws that such stores won't be allowed: grocery store jobs used to be a stepping-stone for teens, now they're also security blankets for adults.

[dewline]

Referring to siliconshaman's comments elsewhere in this thread. Because you both have valid points here.

[dewline]

I always make a point of going to the human cashier at Shoppers Drug Mart, Loblaws and the like. And I am trying to make a point of doing the same whenever practicable at my bank as well.

Thank you!

[ysabetwordsmith]

For supporting jobs, human interaction, and choice.

[kengr]

They had self checkout for *years at the grocery store I live next to. The removed them a year or so back. according to a couple of employees I am friends with it was because of the amount of stuff that got out the door without being paid for.

Yay!

[ysabetwordsmith]

Behold the clue, and the having of it!

[gatheringrivers]

Hmmm, is there some sort of overall map of possible Amish settlement areas? I've tried looking in the past, but outside of a few well known (to me) areas (Kidron, OH -ish being one of them, since I order from Lehmans occasionally) I'm not sure where to start. :(


I don't mind a FEW cashier-less lanes (like 4 or less, really) - because I've had a few days where I've done lots of errands already that day, and I'm totally out of talking-to-people spoons for a while.

But most of the time, I prefer the cashiers, I like having conversation if I'm just going to be standing there anyway. :)

Try this ...

[ysabetwordsmith]

Amish population map:
https://i.pinimg.com/564x/5f/04/0b/5f040b66ed6a7444719fbf04a5a9a7bb.jpg

Amish state guide:
https://amishamerica.com/amish-state-guide/

Amish settlements in 2013:
https://kb.osu.edu/bitstream/handle/1811/57700/JAPAS_Donnermeyer_Luthy_vol1-issue2_pp107-129.pdf

Mapping tools:
https://cupola.gettysburg.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1083&context=esfac

Re: Try this ...

[gatheringrivers]

Yay! Thank you! :)

I hate self check

[ravan]

I had to tell 2 people in Walmart Saturday that I don't use self check. They turned all but 4 lanes into self check - I was pissed. Tney offered to "help me" with self check, thinking that my not wanting to use it was because of age and idiocy. No, asshole, I don't like them, but I know full well how to use them. If I wanted to spend my time scanning groceries, I'd get a cashier job.

Re: I hate self check

[ysabetwordsmith]

I like to start talking about how it's morally wrong to take people's jobs away, and that's why we need unions.

Since the U-word can get people fired in Wal-Mart, that gives them strong incentive to do whatever is required to make it go away.

I tried searching for multiple variations on how to fight self-checkout lanes, but got no hits -- just articles about why they are awful and why people will be forced to use them like it or not.

Welp, I guess I'll have to do it myself.

Re: I hate self check

[ravan]

The best thing I can do is loudly refuse to use them. Yes, I'm playing into the Boomer "Karen" stereotype when I do so, but I can easily hold forth at length why I hate them, why they aren't customer service, why they only work for 10 items or less, and even then not with cigarettes, liquor and gift cards, etc, etc, etc.

[fred_mouse]

our local supermarket installed one of those automated checkouts, and in very short order removed them again,

Yay!

[ysabetwordsmith]

Some people are capable of learning from their mistakes.

[fianna9]

Not a self-checkout story but you might be interested in how the robot restaurants are going

https://futurism.com/the-byte/san-francisco-robot-restaurants-out-business

full article below but wants ad-blocker turned off or a subscription
https://www.businessinsider.com/san-francisco-robot-restaurants-failing-eatsa-cafex-2020-1